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Liberty In Law

Evolution and relativism
« on: June 12, 2007, 04:58:39 pm »

A fundamental error in society is the unfounded belief in Evolution. This belief underlies many of the attacks on our freedoms, because it denies the existence of a Creator to which an individual is responsible. There can be no future state of rewards and punishments if Evolution is correct; nor can there be any absolute or certain standard of Law or rights. The highest good becomes winning the universal contest for supremacy.

It should not be surprising that some of the greatest tyrannies in history were formed under this logic. Adolf Hitler was an Evolutionist; and so were Joseph Stalin, Benito Mussollini, and Mao Tse-Tung.

With the introduction of the teaching of Evolution as fact in schools (which it certainly is not; see for instance http://www.answersingenesis.org) our culture and government began to plummet as well.For more info, please visit my website, http://worldviewsrevolution.blogspot.com

Thanks! -R. Josiah Magnuson
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Curmudgeon

Re: Evolution and relativism
« Reply #1 on: June 12, 2007, 09:26:24 pm »

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Quote from: Liberty In Law on June 12, 2007, 04:58:39 pm
There can be no future state of rewards and punishments if Evolution is correct; nor can there be any absolute or certain standard of Law or rights. The highest good becomes winning the universal contest for supremacy.

While I don't disagree, one could argue that the many faces of religion, each defending their own ideals of Creator, don't lend themselves too well to absolute or certain standard of Law or rights any more than evolution.

"Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between man and his God, that he owes account to none other for is faith or his worship, that the legislative powers of government reach actions only, and not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should "make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof," thus building a wall of separation between Church and State. Adhering to this expression of the supreme will of the nation in behalf of the rights of conscience, I shall see with sincere satisfaction the progress of those sentiments which tend to restore to man all his natural rights, convinced he has no natural right in opposition to his social duties." Thomas Jefferson

Perhaps the argument isn't so much about evolution being taught in schools as it is about the institution of public school.
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Conte

Re: Evolution and relativism
« Reply #2 on: June 12, 2007, 10:06:35 pm »

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Although I find the Evolution v. Creation debate somewhat of a mute point, and not the most pressing issue when it comes to restoring our republic, it is rather fascinating. I believe in God, and that there is strong evidence for intelligent design of our world and universe.

Still, I also believe in evolution and the evolutionary process (yet with intelligence behind it). Really, evolution is a theory, that has not been completely proven, and creation is a faith based theory, that doesn't necessarily or typically have a scientific foundation. Yet, many Christians, or faiths, say that since all truth is God's truth, and scientific truth is in that realm, then faith and science should not be in conflict, but rather agreement.

There are creation approaches that I cannot agree with (like the literal seven 24hr day idea - and that the Earth is at best only 7,000 years old). That is why I could hold a stance that evolution could very well be the correct scientific theory for how our universe and earth were formed, but that it was directed with intelligent design.

Still, that is not the real debate here. The debate is that neither theory or approach gives any moral backing for social conduct in the world we find ourselves in. This could be a long debate.

Still, I find that there is significant difference on the significance of social moral conduct. Believing that everything just happened by chance and without intelligent design leaves a moral void which then relies on man's individual creation of a moral code, which seems to become rather relative. Yet, if we believe that there is intelligent design that created (through evolution) where and who we are, ingrained with a social moral code (that seems to have been greatly perverted and made relative by man), then there is a basis that does not change, that is not relative, and that gives a foundation for humanity and how we should treat one another and our world.

I see it as not just affecting a need for a relationship with the creator, but also our relationship with each other and places a sense of accountability, calling, and responsibility. If what is happening to our country and the world, with the NWO, the powerful taking control of the "weak", etc., then why fight it? Maybe it's just a part of the evolutionary process, etc.

Do you get my point? Anyway, I'm sure I could say a lot more, but I think I've said plenty, and again, it's not really an essential issue for fighting evil, bringing justice, and restoring our republic. What do you think?
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Curmudgeon

Re: Evolution and relativism
« Reply #3 on: June 13, 2007, 01:01:01 am »

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Quote from: Conte on June 12, 2007, 10:06:35 pm
If what is happening to our country and the world, with the NWO, the powerful taking control of the "weak", etc., then why fight it? Maybe it's just a part of the evolutionary process, etc.

Part of an evolutionary process? Probably. But a NWO? led by who? Quis custodiate ipsos custodus?

I'll accept a one world government ...... as long as it's not run by humans.
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Liberty In Law

Re: Evolution and relativism
« Reply #4 on: June 13, 2007, 08:42:13 am »
Quote Modify Remove
If what is happening to our country and the world, with the NWO, the powerful taking control of the "weak", etc., then why fight it? Maybe it's just a part of the evolutionary process, etc.

Thanks, Conte. You just wrapped up my whole comment!

However, you still say that Evolution vs. Creation is a mute point. This I don't understand. You are taking two positions at once.

One either believes in God, His Words, and His moral standard, or one does not. There is no middle ground, since what is at stake is the existence of absolutes. One cannot believe absolutes are both important and unimportant, correct? And so if absolutes in fact exist and there is a true right and wrong, those who attempt to discredit those absolutes are committing a serious offense indeed. It is my opinion that the struggle against Evolution (and every other system which teaches naturalism and relativism) is the most important of them all; for without a Creator we have no rights and no moral cause for liberty.

Can the liberties of a nation be thought secure when we have removed their only firm basis, a conviction in the minds of the people that these liberties are the gift of God? -Thomas Jefferson

Thanks! From R. Josiah Magnuson
www.WorldviewsRevolution.blogspot.com
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Conte

Re: Evolution and relativism
« Reply #5 on: June 13, 2007, 09:37:48 pm »

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Point taken, Liberty In Law. I agree with you, but at this juncture in the most pressing issues for even beginning to defeat the NWO, the Evolution / Creation debate is not going to go far for a while. There has to be a major shift in thinking that is not going to happen overnight (not that anything happens overnight anyway).

With the growing number of people who do not believe in God, or have no understanding of how the Creation / Evolution debate affects everything else (because it really is an issue of Theism vs. Atheism), then I feel the best we can do right now, with things so dire and happening so fast, is to try to plead to peoples' sense of goodness, rights, freedom, etc. We can't necessarily expect everyone to connect those things as being grounded in the existence of God.

Our culture and society is jsut so screwed up, and it takes baby steps. I do not mean to say that this issue is not important or essential, but I don't think that arguing this issue is going to get us very far right now. Hope you understand what I'm trying to say...
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Liberty In Law

Re: Evolution and relativism
« Reply #6 on: June 13, 2007, 10:29:29 pm »

Yes, Comte, I understand your position. I agree that there are still many people in our nation who believe in God, and thus we should work with what we've got, and so forth. However, the deal is that many of these people have been lulled into a subdued existence where nothing matters anyway, due to the Evolutionary relativism which is constantly in the back of their minds. If we could show them that Evolution is actually wrong and they and their friends do actually have absolute rights to fight for, we would be getting much further along in our fight for freedom.

Evolution not only takes away the moral standard, it takes away the people's desire to work for this ("non-existent") standard.

We do not only need justice, we need courage. We do not only need freedom, we need awakening from apathy. For these, we need a renewed trust in our Creator; and we need to remember our heritage and grand Providential beginnings. As our U.S. Congress declared fifty years ago, the real identity of America may be summed up in four simple words:

IN GOD WE TRUST.


-R. Josiah Magnuson
www.WorldviewsRevolution.blogspot.com